Discussion Forums - Film Noir

I always thought of movies like, Double Indemnity, The Maltese Falcon, or the newer movie, Brick.

I just read through this Wiki-Pedia article, http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Film_noir   and it seems to encompass a much wider style than I was aware of.

Any thoughts? Any favorites?

My thoughts, of both traditional and unusal noir films are: Chinatown, The Big Sleep, Murder My Sweet, The Maltese Falcon, Notorious, L. A. Confidential, Laura, Scarlet Street, Double Indemnity, The Postman Always Rings Twice, Strangers on a Train, The Black Dahlia, Mullholland Drive, Sin City and Who Framed Roger Rabbit

"Number 23" with Jim Carrey has that Film Noir "feel" to it, don't you think?

The section in the Wikipedia definition about the difficulty of defining Film Noir is exactly right. There is no consensus on the definition of Film Noir. I personally do consider it a genre, but mine is a minority opinion among Noir ethusiasts.

There is, of course, the "Golden Age" beginning, arguably, in 1941 with The Maltese Falcon, and continuing through the 1940s with Double Indemnity, The Postman Always Rings Twice (which Noir "definers" Raymond Borde and Etienne Chaumeton bizarrely consider "on the fringes" of Noir), and Out of the Past (the definitive Film Noir, in my book). Purists will argue that Noir officially ended in 1958 with Touch of Evil, but don't you believe it (Chinatown, Farewell, My Lovely, Taxi Driver, and To Live and Die in L.A., anyone?).

Unfortunately, the designation Film Noir has become a marketing term. VCI Entertainment has released a slew of grade B and C crime-drama potboilers, packaged with the label "Forgotten Noir." Very few of VCI's releases strike me as Film Noir.

When I hear or see the words "Film Noir," these are (a few of) the movies that spring to mind:

The Stranger on the Third Floor (the first, American sound Noir, as far as I'm concerned), 1940, starring John McGuire, Margaret Tallachet, and Peter Lorre as the titular creep. Screenplay by Frank Partos. Directed by Boris Ingster.

Scarlet Street, 1945, starring Edward G. Robinson, Joan Bennett, and Dan Duryea. Screenplay by Dudley Nichols, based on the French novel and play "La Chienne" by Georges de la Fouchardiere. Directed by Fritz Lang. The director and trio of stars of Woman in the Window reteamed and topped that thriller, marred by a cop-out Hollywood ending, by getting it right the second time around.

Out of the Past, 1947, starring Robert Mitchum, Jane Greer, and Kirk Douglas. Screenplay by Geoffery Homes (Daniel Mainwaring) based on his novel "Build My Gallows High." Directed by Jacques Tourneur. 'Nuff said!

Criss Cross, 1949, starring Burt Lancaster, Yvonne DeCarlo, and Dan Duryea. Screenplay by Daniel Fuchs, based on the novel by Don Tracy. Directed by Robert Siodmak. For me, a grim, downbeat ending is absolutely essential in a true Noir, and endings don't come much grimmer or moe downbeat than the closing scene in this gem.

Kiss Me Deadly, 1955, starring Ralph Meeker, Maxine Cooper, and Albert Dekker. Screenplay by A.I. Bezzerides, based on the novel by Mickey Spillaine. Directed by Robert Aldrich. "Atomic" Noir loaded with style to burn; reportedly a major influence on French Nouvelle Vague filmmakers.

Sweet Smell of Success, 1957, starring Burt Lancaster and Tony Curtis. Screenplay by Clifford Odets, story adapted by Ernest Lehman from his novel. Directed by Alexander MacKendrick. "A [delicious] cookie full of arsenic."

D.O.A.

Great titles mentioned here. 

I'd have to add The Third Man.

Love Blade Runner as neo-noir.

I even seen an Terminator 2 brought into the discussion in the book Shades of Noir

I have many that you guys have listed and have seen almost all of them.

"The Killers" (1946) with Burt Lancaster in his first starring role, Edmond O'Brien and Ava Gardner is a GREAT movie to see if you haven't. Love 'Out of the Past' as was mentioned. 

http://www.imdb.com/title/tt0038669/?licb=0.2477174922823906

I may be old fashioned (I probably am), but like authentic rock & roll music (a combination of rockabilly and rhythm & blues), which is set in a particular era, it seems to have begun forming in  the early '50s, ending around 1959.  Authentic film noir has certain stirrings in the late '30s and peaks sometime during the '40s, with many excellent noirs being released into the 1950s.  But as rock & roll was "Mono," I think film noir is "Black & White," primarily.  There's an unmistakable feel to film noir that is aided by being black & white.  Films like Chinatown do re-create the genre, but it being a color film seems to take something away from it that's more or less indefinable.  There's a certain, bona fide feel to film noir that doesn't seem to happen with more modern films as they seem to be in the post-film noir era.  Take L.A. Confidential, for instance.  Is it noir?  It sure seems to be.  But its being in color and R rated, with none of the double entendre or mysterious clues that leave you guessing, it seems to be sort of extra-noir somehow.  It's a very fine point, I know, and one that a lot of people will instantly dismiss, but I think it's at least worthy of consideration.

The Thirteenth Floor is probably the best example of a newer Tech-Noir.  I would also add Shutter Island as a Noir type....it does get confusing and many people differ on what they call noir.  Even in academia/cinema studies.